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+--- Thread: Turbo bike part 1 - Brain transplant (/showthread.php?tid=1286)
Turbo bike part 1 - Brain transplant - 1hotBUSA - 18-09-2005
Hi everybody,
One of the things that I decided to do when I commenced installing this turbo kit into the bike was to tell people the steps that I took so that we can remove the smoke and mirrors around installing a turbo into the bike.
The first stage for me was to give the bike a brain transplant. There are two routes you can go with a turbo, one path is with an FMU like the Ghetto kit which is like a regulator that increases fuel pressure with boost pressure, so the stock injectors can flow more into the cylinders. This method also requires an PC2 or PC3 to adjust fuelling. The other path, which I have taken is to put an aftermarket ECU into the bike and increase the size of the injectors. The stock injectors are 225cc and will give up the ghost at around 190hp in a forced induction application. In the future I will fit injectors of around 400cc into the bike.
The ECU used is S&R Pro's TSI unit. This is a very powerful tool which gives you absolute control over almost every aspect of the engine management system. To fit this unit required about 14 connections to be made into the wiring loom of the bike. Needless to say you're pretty worried at this point because your cutting wires that will mean the pride and joy wont run if you screw it up. So it's a deep breath then get snipping.
This is all the wires connected in to the loom and the re looming underway. I located the TSI on the left hand side of the bike in front of the reg/rec under the rear seat. This will leave room for the water tank and the water injection system to come later. Pre planning the job is important as you can see.
Here you can see the TSI in the lower centre of the screen, look for the cable ties and you've found it. The TSI unit here is connected via a 9 pin serial cable to my computer so that mapping could commence.
Here is the PC fired up and ready to commence mapping. The advantage of the TSI unit over the PC2-3 or the Yosh box is that the tuning of the engine is live. When you make a change on the PC you make a change on the computer. I found that the TSI did not have a zero map in it so when I fired the beast into life there was a huge cloud of black smoke then the motor died.
So I saved what was in the ECU into my PC, then zeroed the whole map. This involved setting all the fuelling, ignition, TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) etc to zero and mapping the bike from the TPS. Success, she fired into life and ran as it did before, and above is the screen shot of it doing that.
Now I need to get the bike mapped for the TSI and then we are good to go. That will give me a map that is good for a naturally aspirated bike. This can then be evolved as the turbo application is applied.
Regards
Graham
1hotBUSA
2000 Suzuki Hayabusa Red/Grey Bog standard except for bling and a kanooter valve. Oh and a turbo kit on the floor.
Strike a blow for freedom...Smash a speed camera!!!
Red Bikes Rule!!!!!<i>Edited by: 1hotBUSA at: 18/9/05 6:00 pm
</i>
190 Hp - fasterfaster1 - 18-09-2005
Stock injectors only good to 190 Hp ? You'll need two sets FF1 <i>Edited by: fasterfaster1 at: 18/9/05 8:41 pm
</i>
Re: 190 Hp - 1hotBUSA - 18-09-2005
I'm toying wether to go with 400cc injectors or to go all the way to 750cc injectors. The 440's will flow the HP that I want, the 750's will never need to come out again, but the trick then is getting the mongrel to idle. They'd be some big negative numbers on the map then me thinks!
Regards
Graham
1hotBUSA
2000 Suzuki Hayabusa Red/Grey Bog standard except for bling and a kanooter valve. Oh and a turbo kit on the floor.
Strike a blow for freedom...Smash a speed camera!!!
Red Bikes Rule!!!!!<i></i>
Flow rate - gazza414 - 18-09-2005
Graham , where are you quoting the std injector flow rate from ? and at what duty cycle?
thanks <i></i>
Re: Flow rate - the shredder 3 - 18-09-2005
Hey my ghetto bike is still running stock injectors
but they are maxed out. 8#boost standard comp 285 hp 10#boost lowered comp 270 hp .4000 klms so far
If I want to up the boost I've got a set of s2000 honda injectors to go in. <i></i>
Re: Flow rate - gazza414 - 18-09-2005
Shane, and the fuel pressure is at 285hp? <i></i>
Re: Flow rate - the shredder 3 - 18-09-2005
43 psi at idle
bout 80 to 90 at full noise if you can hang on long
enough to read it (he he.) <i></i>
Re: Flow rate - gazza414 - 19-09-2005
yer at 90psi they are near lockup.
I think Graham is quoting at 3bar... 43.5psi.
<i></i>
Re: Flow rate - hawkwind racing - 19-09-2005
I have done some research and figures for my turbo transformation, methanol 2x 1600cc injectors per cylinder and an autronic sm4 oh and 3x bosch fuel pumps in parallel this will feed the beast up to 40psi @ ???? HP all I need know is for that big red ball to drop my way
lotsa fun building these contraptions
Gary <i></i>
Re: Flow rate - 1hotBUSA - 19-09-2005
Hi there,
I am quoting at 43psi off the stock pump and the stock regulator. Shredder you will get higher values because the FMU pushes the pressure up, but I bet you ditched the cheesecake pump to do that. The Duty cycle I am not sure, i think it is 100% as this was the point the injectors started getting erratic. I do know they are 225cc jobbies.
Honda S2000 Injectors. Where do you get em. Looked on Ebay, nothing. Regards
Graham
1hotBUSA
2000 Suzuki Hayabusa Red/Grey Bog standard except for bling and a kanooter valve. Oh and a turbo kit on the floor.
Strike a blow for freedom...Smash a speed camera!!!
Red Bikes Rule!!!!!<i></i>
Re: Flow rate - Maj750t - 19-09-2005
s2k injectors are still a bit small for a boost referenced 1;1 regulated system,
Found a nice injector calculator the other day www.witchhunter.com/injectorcalc1.htm .
Pick your hp and see what fuel you need. <i></i>
Re: Flow rate - 1hotBUSA - 19-09-2005
Hello again,
That calculator is better than the RCEng calculator, less double dutch in it's use. I think I need bigger than 400cc injectors at the 80% duty cycle though, I need to be above 550cc for what i want to do. E mailed RCEng, no reply......
Regards
Graham
1hotBUSA
2000 Suzuki Hayabusa Red/Grey Bog standard except for bling and a kanooter valve. Oh and a turbo kit on the floor.
Strike a blow for freedom...Smash a speed camera!!!
Red Bikes Rule!!!!!<i></i>
Re: Flow rate - Maj750t - 19-09-2005
I had no reply when i emailed too but when i ordered there was no problem with contact for payment details
<i></i>
Tsi map - Blackkat - 19-09-2005
Graham,
Sorry about the Tsi map- forgot to hit save once I cleared them
I did have a couple of things on my mind at the time
On the plus side that map was a 400 hp map
With injector sizes I can only suggest what we run in ours if you chose to run s2000 or something else and lean out your motor then thats on your head. Choose wisely and listen carefully.
Leonard
<i></i>
Re: Injectors - gazza414 - 19-09-2005
Graham wrote
I am quoting at 43psi off the stock pump and the stock regulator. Shredder you will get higher values because the FMU pushes the pressure up, but I bet you ditched the cheesecake pump to do that. The Duty cycle I am not sure, i think it is 100% as this was the point the injectors started getting erratic. I do know they are 225cc jobbies.
WRONG -- go check your source or better still have them flowed then quote the values. <i></i>