Col
How can you say that I have an attitude problem, we have never met in person or spoken over the phone. Obviously you are biased given that JP is a good friend of yours and I can understand that. However, I think JP is only giving you one side of the story as well. You can not imagine the shit that I and especially my dealer have gone through over the past months in relation to getting some kind of favorable response from Suzuki. The sub frame issue is a major problem for Suzuki and I believe they (Suzuki) have adopted the attitude that if they stonewall for long enough the problem will go away. This was the exact response I got from JP when I rang him myself. Ask JP and he’ll tell you that I did not have the “YOU OWE ME” attitude over the phone. I was seriously concerned that my bike could suffer such a major structural problem with the cause being normal riding. By the end of our conversation I was amazed and pissed off at the attitude of Suzuki (JP). They had obviously adopted the stonewall attitude as policy regarding sub frame replacement and in my opinion that’s bullshit.
As I mentioned in a previous post, my dealer and myself are in the process of writing a serious letter of complaint to the MD and GM of Suzuki Australia as this whole issue has been a joke from the very start. My dealer went into bat for me and as a result has probably lost any future favors or flexibility with Suzuki in relation to the service department. As for being to f**king stupid to own a motorbike, if JP said that to me down the street or at a pub - no problem. You mentioned how helpful he has been with his board, that’s fine but who is he representing every time he posts – Suzuki. For a representative of Suzuki to imply a customer is to f**king stupid to own a bike, that’s a joke. As for JP receiving phone calls from irate customers that comes with the job, ask anyone in customer service.
Col, have you suffered from the sub frame fault? If not put yourself in my position. Imagine if you had your wife, girlfriend or kids on the back. There is a serious or fatal accident waiting to happen and I cannot understand why Suzuki won’t do a recall, imagine the payout if there is an accident or fatality. Transfer this problem to a car. Imagine if your car is two months out of warranty and under normal driving suffers a major structural fault and it leaves you not being able to drive the car. I’m sure Holden or Ford would come to the party.
My opinion on the class action – not a good idea. What I would suggest is put together a database of everyone that has suffered from the sub frame fault and collectively go to Suzuki and seek replacement or compensation. It seems calling JP an arrogant prick has clouded the main issue of the sub frame replacement, the doors are now open for everyone.
Two things to come of this, firstly, any credibility Suzuki had with me is certainly gone and secondly, my busa is for sale. Anyone know of anyone interested in a busa 22500Km on the clock and with a new sub frame please ring 0418 246 505
Regards,
John
"The best way to get help is to ask for it nicely"
Good advise Col but can you see somewhere in my posting any evidence of hatred or malice.I'm very sorry if I've pissed YOUR friend off but all I wanted was three simple questions answered .I don't see any other posts from representatives of SUZUKI AUSTRALIA so I thought as this fellow seems to work for them a response would probably be reasonable to expect as he seems to have some knowledge of the subject matter. I did not at any stage think that asking these questions would in any way "stuff it up for everyone".
I suppose it would be easy to sit back pontificate on the subjects discussed and not really want to rock the boat or put someones nose out of joint , and as for taking on a company that has more wealth than a small group of people who inadvertently purchase one of their products with a defect that could put their lives in danger(how dare they)assume they have the ability to take said company to task.What would you suggest we do Col? ride around on an unsafe bike hoping that it holds together through the next corner and thanking our lucky stars that we didn't have to pay extra for the thing to be safe and roadworthy.
You see there isn't a lot of logic in your opinion ,WE have already paid good hard earned money for a motorcycle that at the very least should be roadworthy if there is a recall so be it, was there a huge difference in price once the cam chain tensioner problem was addressed? You see Col if you cease to exist because of this problem you won't be able to think about it!!!! (think about it)
I wouldn't know you from a bar of soap Col and I'm not asking you to take on JP's job so don't think that this is some personal attack on you ,but is it to much to ask?
Three simple questions -- three simple answers.
G'day Darth And John?
Well since these arn't your real names this is the best I can do.
First of all, you need to read a post before you can answer one. In simple terms, read what it said not what you think it said. I get real tired of people telling me what they think I said. So, READ IT AGAIN.
JP may be a good friend or is that feind? Either way your problem has only been discussed earlier this year and it was only an opinion JP was after on possible owner setup situations regarding suspension settings. So your thoughts on a two edged setup are so wrong. Please use another angle of attack, as this on won't wash.
Words fail me at this point, so I'll cut to the chase. Every story is never really told by the story teller, fiction seems to become relality, and the more we tell our story the more real it becomes. This my friends is a fact of life. So, how about the full story? Or has it become so much fiction that the real story will never be told? Just a honest answer is all that is required, but please do tell the full story.
As I said in my previous post JP was a straight shooter well before we became friends and in my opinion he hasn't changed one bit.
I would suggest one thing, and that is the real story be put forward before you guys are shut down.
Regards Col
PS How about a bit of support from all the fence sitters that have had assistance from JP over the years, or is that asking too much?
Hi guys,
The threat to leave and never return when said in return for crappy after sales service should be taken seriously. I rode kwaks for years and years then ran into 2 really bad models. The original GPZ1100(1981) and the third GPZ1100 (1983?). Long story not told here but as I sat in the office of the general manager of Kwak Australia I told him that if left unsatisfied I would NEVER own another kwak. 20 years later I have owned Yamahas (FJs) and Suzukis (GSXR11 and the "Busa). The few dollars it would have taken to retain me as the faithful follower have cost them a lot of dollars and I will NEVER own another. Suzuki can be as big a corporate dickhead as any of the motorcycle builders. They just have to be smart enough to avoid pissing enough of us off with crappy after sales service so we NEVER buy another of their wonderful bikes. Perception is everything as is the hand holding the dollars.
Max
Col, you should work for Suzuki.
Folks, I'm new to the board and bracing myself for my inaugural flaming. This thread has been an interesting read for me as it affects me and weaves in and out of an understandably emotional issue seeming to result in nothing more than personal attacks on people and a lot of smoke with little action or progress on the real issue.
We're all bike riders here right? In fact it would seem that we are mostly Suzuki devotees that mostly love or ride the Busa (or both). Even John Phillips.
How do I know this? I read Johnl34’s original post because I’m a worried owner of a 99 Busa, who has up until recently, ridden with my wife on the back (the Busas the problem, not my wife). Spotting John Phillips name in the middle of the post, I gave him a call. He was on the phone, so I left a vmail for him and within a couple of hours, he called me back. I explained my predicament, which is probably not that different to many of you. 99, out of warranty, no breakage, don’t want one, am extremely concerned about it and of course, will Suzuki replace it before disaster happens? The answer that JP gave on behalf of Suzuki Australia was in essence that:
1. Each case is being assessed individually by the FACTORY.
2. Each of the cases has arisen as the result of an actual breakage.
3. There has been no recall.
4. To his knowledge, genuine claims have been met.
5. Most if not all of these claims were in warranty.
6. I’m out in the cold – no warranty, no breakage, just fear.
He then spoke with me as a guy who rides a 99 Busa. He took the time to let know that me he thinks the breakages are the result of torsional stress and that my wife should not use the pillion pegs when climbing aboard, where the breakages occur, how to inspect and reassured me that the breakage is not as disastrous as most of us imagine and that the bike SHOULD be controllable if breakage occurs. In short, nothing that I haven’t discovered elsewhere.
Am I happy with the official Suzuki response? Hell no. And I’m not settling for it. I’ve lodged a complaint with the Department Of Fair Trading to have it assessed independently and will happily collate incidents from each of you no matter where you are from, whether you have had a failure or no. Drop me an email, tell me your story and I’ll post what I hear and discover as I wade my way through government assisted bureaucracy before we start spending private dollars in the courts. I will use this information (providing I also have your consent to) to apply pressure to all applicable government departments as well as Suzuki Australia, who I am sure will pass that pressure back to the factory. Busa @ 11k is co-ordinating a similar action in the US and I’m happy to take the lead locally.
For the record:
1. JP was decent and reasonable when I spoke with him.
2. I don’t think I’ve met or know any of you personally yet, including JP or Col, but I consider you all mates and would happily hook up for a ride or a beer (but not both)
3. My Busa’s been sitting idle in the garage for about two months whilst I work on THIS problem, as I just don’t feel safe on it anymore.
4. When JP gets on this board, he comes on as a member, fan and rider, not as a representative of Suzuki. Legally he couldn’t possibly risk that, but sensibly, who do you know that represents their company 24 x 7? In this space, JP should be allowed to be JP, not JP of Suzuki.
5. I don’t see why we should be sledging each other when we have traditionally helped each other. One of the things I love about the bike world is that it’s a bit of an equaliser. We all love’em, most of us give other riders a nod gidday (even the postie) and when you pull up at the lights, you’ll almost always have a bit of a yak. There’s plenty more, but this post is already challenging most known length records.
Well, if you made it this far congrats… sorry it wound up being such an epic. Remember, if you have or had a 99-00 Busa and would like to see some action, drop me a line and give me your details and a story if you have one. As my ezboard profile will tell you, you can get me at either ozibusa@hotmail.com or ozibusa@optushome.com.au.
Let’s get it sorted and stop hacking at each other. That’s my $0.02.
Mick (from Sydney, not Canberra)
P.S. When I typed "would happily hook up for a ride or a beer (but not both)" I meant both at the SAME time.
Mick, I'll meet you for a beer or a ride (but not both) anytime. I agree, this board does get a little heated at times mainly because we are all passionate about our bikes (well maybe not the R1, but bikes in general).
This is a fabulous forum for discussion and information, when I first bought the 'bus I would have had a lot more problems without this forum to ask questions and get feedback. I haven't had personal dealings with JP, but let him be a board member as opposed to a representative of Suzuki. I would HATE to be considered a representative of where I work whenever I raised my head.
HEIDI xxx
(ducking for cover)
Yeah, well said Mick.
Col, I've already said what I have to say on this (refer the 3rd post on this thread). I don't know what else you expect me to say, as I "fence sitter" I mean.
Col ,
I haven't got a clue as to what your on about and I read it four times!!! attack ,wash ,what the ?????
No my real name is not darthbusa , I do not come from a galaxy far far away, and I have never used the force (oh well rarely) But R2D2 would be great as a pillion for detecting speed cameras.
My name is Mick as you would have noticed from the bottom of my first post (you have to read these things properly instead of giving everybody advice on how to READ your posts.)"you see you have to read a post before you can answer one"------ Col 8-5-2002
How about trying to help the situation instead of putting shit on us (I'm not a pig either)and saying that this thing is to hard or it'll cost to much. I suppose I'd stick up for one of my mates in a situation like this but what happens if someone is seriously hurt or killed will you still feel the same way? How about some ideas of your own.
Forgive me gentlemen for assuming that JP's response was about business that he had previously dealt with as a COMPANY REPRESENTATIVE. I just assumed that they were posted during normal working hours on normal working days ,therefor ......... you see he was responding to a company matter that had been raised with him as a company representative, not giving advise as a member .
I'd love to change hats when things got a little hot.
What does it take for a recall? the company know's that there is a problem have a look at the forums in the U.S.A. and U.K.
Mick(again Col)from Canberra not Sydney.
"But R2D2 would be great as a pillion for detecting speed cameras." thas funny...
But seriously, I'm now self-nominated local lead for this thing & happy to be so. I'm equally happy to hand over or share the reigns with any one else that would like to help the change.
I've already had the first emails through and would like to add you and anyone you know who is or has been affected by this problem to the list of people I can represent as Busa owners.
If you aren't an affected owner, please get me your details anyway and I'll add you to the disillousioned, disgusted or annoyed, Suzuki customer petition.
What does it take to get a recall? One of two things most likely. Enough known examples of the problem to warrant risk to a signifcant segment of the market ergo significant liability exposure to a company aka BIG $$$ or extreme consumer pressure.
Rather continuing to wait for the earlier to accumulate, let's organise the latter.
Once again, the email address is ozibusa@optushome.com.au or the hotmail address. Your choice, I'm active on both.
I'm also looking to hook up with the O/S guys to co-ordinate the response more fully. You are probably already aware that the .org guys are petitioning their National Safety Authority, but see no reason why we can't unite the cause globally.
Cheers,
Sydney Mick
Col,
You have left me totally confused with your last response.
Oh well..... I must be thick.
However,
It is pretty obvious to me that there IS a problem with the aluminium subframe on the 99 -00 Hayabusa.
If this is not the case, why have SUZUKI changed the subframe to steel on the newer models???
I have not had a problem with my '99 (touch wood), but it still is a major concern to me.
Jeff
G'Day All,
I am a new member to the club and regularly read this board which I find most informative.The subframe issue has been at times rather heated, but it is an important issue which must be resolved (not necessarily in this forum).
I am fortunate to own a 2001 model with a steel sub frame, and while this does not directly affect me, I feel "Suzuki" has a moral obligation to resolve this issue as there is obviously a problem with the 99-00 models.
When you spend $18,000.00 or ?? on "anything" you expect it to perform accordingly without the risk of life and limb.If this did affect me, I too would be really p*ssed off and would follow the matter "all the way" until I was satisfied with the outcome.
I am not buying into the "who's wrong and who's right" between those concerned on this board, that does not interest me, what does, is that this matter must be resolved between "Suzuki" and those people that have "99-00" models.
Perhaps you should agree to diagree about this issue and do
what you must to get this problem sorted out with "Suzuki".
I was hoping to introduce myself on a more congenial topic but oh well.
Brett
G'day one and all,
Thanks to the few that saw fit to say thanks to JP for his time over the past while, I'm sure he will thankyou for it.
On the other side of the coin this board seems to have attracted an unusual amount of kcuf wits, dreamers, wankers and keyboard loosers of late. Once this was a good place to have a bit of humour and discuss the joy of riding a busa. Now most of the board is only about bleating sheep hoping to have their 10 seconds of fame.
When the dust settles you guys will be the loosers. You people will never know how much behind the sceens work JP really did.
So kick him as much as you like, but you people will never know how good JP was to you.
I'm so glad to see the NAMES on this board so quite on this subject, fence sitters one day will get a arse full of splinters.
Well that's about it, I'm so sad the kucf wit element has taken over, but, thats life.
Regards Col
PS Keep playing with your busa's and modifying them without really knowing what's going on. I'm sooooo sorry,
but you people deserve it. Good luck, good by and get a life.
Col,
It is hard to talk on a computer.so at the risk of being taken the wrong way as I obviously was in my first post, I was trying to say that instead of everyone arguing about this on the board that perhaps those affected by the problem should talk to "SUZUKI" the Company.
It was not my intent to add fuel to the fire but to perhaps try and change the direction of where it was heading by way of suggestion - "agree to disagree".
My apologies to you and anyone else I may have inadvertently upset.
Regards,
Brett
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