Clutchless shifting... fine, or fatal?

[Astro]

From the thread started by NEMESIS...

I give mine abit of a hiding,my mate went through 2 boxes
on his gixxer under warranty but he done alot of clutchless shifting etc.
I dont do that shit,thats why im abit confused.

Is clutchless shifting really likely to cause gearbox failure? I'm interested to know, because I do a lot of clutchless up-shifts (usually 2nd thru 5th) provided conditions are right. Maybe its a timing thing, but my clutchless shifts are smooth-as. Done properly - without undue force or heavy pre-weighting on the shifter - I always thought this would produce less stress on the box (certainly less stress on the clutch).

I've been doing this on a range of bikes I've owned over many many moons and I've never had a clutch or gearbox failure. Including one bike I owned for almost 10 years. Anecdotally that seems to indicate it's not a major cause of failure - but then again, that's just my experience - so if the more technically minded of this forum tell me its doing damage, I'll have to modify my shifting habits.

[BLACKZOOK]

Done right it does no damage. I have always upshifted without the clutch.

[Achilles]

Done right it does no damage. I have always upshifted without the clutch.

+ 1. My mechanic used to race for Suzuki, and had years and years of experience (and he's a nice bloke). He actually told me that the gears on a Hayabusa are square cut?, and that they are in fact designed to be short shifted.

So, according to him - no issues!

A

[Maj]

Done right it does no damage. I have always upshifted without the clutch.

+ 1. My mechanic used to race for Suzuki, and had years and years of experience (and he's a nice bloke). He actually told me that the gears on a Hayabusa are square cut?, and that they are in fact designed to be short shifted.

So, according to him - no issues!

A

They are not undercut like the GSXR , and can slip out if not fully engaged.
I sometimes do clutchless shifts, esp on the track , but not when cruising.2nd has occasionaly faulted but not regular yet on my streetbike,done this since i brought it (s/h) and figured one day i'll have to fix it .
Properly adjusted gear lever and positive shifts will reduce the chances of a prob

[ROD]

i do most times on the bus as i find you have smoother changes

[Astro]

Ok... sounding good thus far.

[pan]

I heard DOWN-shifting was bad though. Is that true?

[BUSGO]

Good clean clutchless shifting should not be a problem.
It would depend on how much pre load you place on the gear lever before engaging the next gear.

For upshifting, simply placing your toe under the lever and pointing your big toe upwards should be enought to move up a cog as soon as you back off the accellerator.

I wouldn't downshift without a clutch action for fear of possible damage, but it can be done easily enough. I don't see any point in doing it.

[Ozboc]

HI there , I think that a lot of people actually do clucthless shifting ( up gears ) and not even realize it , its especialy evident after many hours of riding when your tired and you do not fully activate the clutch and rather just 'feather' the clutch. Lots of riders learn this style of changes from there dirt bike days ( i still ride dirt bikes - and have a CRF450 )

As other members of this cool forum have said , provided you have no preload on the gear box at time of gear upchange you should not have any damage occur.

You can actually practice this in your manual car, going from gear to neutral without clutch - you need to have neither power on or compression braking happening , but neutral revs to keep in between both loads - you will be able to easily push gear lever into neutral without any effort at all. ( dont try to go to gear though - this is just an excercise in knowing loads and there effects)

as for down shifting - its very difficult to get this right and usually ends in huge 'cluncks' - this is best to be avoided and may end in damage to gear box.

Hope this has been of some help

Boc

[spamanglenn]

if your chain is too tight or you over rev it you will have trouble shifting and can bend your shift forks.At the drags bruce has done a 9.67 and i have done a 9.68 shifting this way.Others flatshift which is holding the throttle pinned and using the clutch to allow the bike to upshift which is probably less strain on the bike.However it does wear you're clutch plates and causes slip.what do you expect, you're pulling the clutch in a 10,000.Or more importantly whilst making 160-170hp.Id be using some decent clutch springs if i was making that a habit.

[Rev]

Fuggen butchers the lot of ya's

[ROD]

Fuggen butchers the lot of ya's

butcher on a butcher of a bike Rev

[NEMESIS]

Hmm,so you dont have to hit a specific RPM to upshift?
An you do it with the accelerator fully depressed?

Yous bunch of butchers hahaaha